(This one was posted back in November, but the November topic was never posted in time and it got kinda lost):
One thing I haven't seen in any reviews of Acme is the Frosted Mug Café. Some stores just look like they've just added a beer department (standard in many supermarkets) with some seating thrown in, but some have taps. Since I assume it's not self-serve, do they have someone serving beer? I've thought that stores that sell beer and wine by the glass are rather cool in and of themselves...
I should go to the one in Concordville. I live about 30 minutes from there, and I've seen the billboards advertising it. I have been to the nearby Whole Foods a few times and they have an actual bar with stools that is in a separate room from the rest of the store. And they serve beer/wine. Most of the beer is merchandised along the walls outside of the store, which lead to a lot of confusion, because people thought they could buy beer at any register. It's restricted to just the register inside of the bar. Which seems pretty stupid to me. Pennsylvania has been updating their alcohol laws, but still have a ways to go.
I also need to get into the new Wegmans up there. I haven't been up there since it was still under construction. It's been open 3 weeks now. I'm sure they have an expansive beer selection as well.
That Wegmans was built a lot smaller than most of their stores. Maybe they realized the general merchandise (which is quite extensive in their larger stores) just isn't moving.
You guys are right! That store is really tiny compared to a typical Wegmans. I shopped there for the first time today and was really surprised at how small every department was and how small the various grocery sections were. And the store is even in there sideways, which is odd. I came through the side door into the cafe/pub and was met with a lot of exiting traffic. Next time i'll know better and go through the front. I'm also curious as to what all opens up in the strip malls in front of the store.
The doors of cold single beer/make your own 6 packs was a nice touch, though. They really were focusing on craft and higher end beers instead of throwing a bunch of Coors and Bud in our faces.
Rumors of more conversions Boonton I have pretty much confirmed and on their blog Acme is not denying it nor are they denying West Milford on the other hand they kind of debunk The Patterson New York rumor. Any other A&P, Pathmark, SuperFresh even Waldbaums Acme conversation rumors out there?
West Milford would make sense since that's a similar situation as the one in places like Sussex, Vernon and Blairstown. I'm thinking quite a few locations make sense for considerably less than they would have sold for months ago but haven't heard anything being mentioned.
I think West Milford would be a big mistake as there is a shop rite right down the street and another shop rite in Warwick NY about 15 min or so away. It didn't do any business at all as A&P unless Acme goes in and does a full scale remodel and upgrade before they reopen, then maybe it will work.
On the other hand, there are other places where Acme (and other stores) do just fine competing with ShopRite. The question (I guess) is how much of the not doing business was due to the location and how much of it was due to the operator (A&P)?
It's probably a little of both. I serviced that store for a little over 2 years as a vendor. Was my worst store on my route. That's why I'm saying maybe it's a mistake for Acme. Like I said maybe if they get the store really cheap and do a full fledged remodel then maybe it might work. Otherwise I think something like Dollar General might work good there, kinda like the one that went into the old Acme in Newton, NJ.
Haggen bit off way more than they could chew, and went bankrupt and is selling off all their stores. The judge even allowed Albertsons to buy back some locations since there were no other bidders.
There's an Acme connection to the Haggen saga. At least two of the stores (2235 University Ave and 422 W. Washington St. in San Diego) were built as Acme-era peak-roofed Alpha Betas. However, Albertson's is not buying either one of these locations.
From what I can tell, there aren't many links left in the chain. It seems that the name is tarnished right now. However, in a few years maybe someone could open stores under the A&P name.
chris p- The oldest supermarket chain in the U.S., the name, and their partnerships of companies. Remember Hostess? They went bankrupt but a few years later somebody else bought the company and resumed manufacturing.
They did not buy Hostess. They bought the names of the iconic products within ie: twinkies, Wonderbread. Similar to the way A&P sold off the 8 o'clock coffee brand a number of years back. A&P has not had a positive name recognition in many years. Its time to lay to rest the name and not let emotional attachments cloud vision.
Actually, one company bought out Hostess and resumed manufacturing in their existing facilities, but without the unions. They also ship through store warehouses/distributors, not direct store delivery like they were before (which also eliminates another union).
Flowers Foods bought Wonder and the other bread brands. Incidentally, Flowers also owns Tastykake in Philadelphia. They bit off more they could chew when they built their new HQ, so they needed someone to bail them out.
Drake, which was part of Hostess, was sold separately to Little Debbie. Their distributors now deliver Drake brand cakes.
You can't buy a chain if the chain doesn't exist. If someone was going to step up and buy A&P they would've done so right after the company started selling off stores. The reason why they didn't was because A&P was damaged goods, damaged so severely that it would've taken an absolute miracle to turn it around.
Patterson is going to open in January, this from Brewster and Mahopac employees! Chase bank moves into a trailer in the parking lot until Acme takes over.
Here's the thing about bank branches: they have a license to operate a branch at a specific location. If they wish to move to a different location, they have to obtain permission from their regulator. For example, when a branch of a local bank burned to the ground, they needed permission if they wanted to locate to another building or if they wanted to close the branch. Not sure what they would have done if both were declined, given there was no more building. But I digress.
It is easier to get permission from a regulator to temporarily operate out of a temporary structure, such as a trailer, in the parking lot of the existing branch location than it is to relocate the branch.
That's OK - I remember one area up this way where Rite Aid was rebuilding their store and they moved the pharmacy portion into a trailer down the street in the supermarket's parking lot. Apparently where they were there was not room to build a new store without closing and removing the old one.
One of the Rite Aids in my hometown did the trailer thing too, but they were forced into doing so because the roof collapsed in the store and they had to rebuild the entire store from the ground up.
I've seen banks operate out of trailers. One was when a strip mall burned and they were forced out. The just dropped a trailer in the parking lot and kept on going.
The other was when another bank was waiting for their branch to be built. They operated out of the trailer before they broke ground for the actual branch if memory serves me correctly.
Makes perfect sense for Chase to open in a trailer, as a storefront would require higher rents, new signage, etc.
Most of their décor, furnishings, and signage, I imagine, is still intact at the A&P, and doing this will ensure the fact that once ACME reopens, the bank will move back in without much trouble.
I took pictures of Yorktown Heights and Shrub Oak when They were still A&Ps i'm going to see if I can get them again as Acme the next time I am in Westchester County
I believe Washington Township was also once a Foodtown. Nicholas Markets Inc who now owns the WT Foodtown is going to do a major renovation right after the holidays as its going to be similar to the North Haledon location.
When Foodtown imploded, it was the Vitale stores that were sold off, as it was one of the Vitale brothers that caused the implosion. I don't think Nicholas got rid of stores until later on, after their failed attempt at being Adams food stores (a name used by other stores that were also supplied by Bozzuto's).
So all of the Nicholas stores had that Adams Super Food Store name? Weird.
Honestly, I was surprised that Nicholas got rid of their Paterson and Haledon stores. Especially the Haledon store because that was right on the main drag. I'm also surprised, considering Nicholas is based there, that they didn't make a run at the Woodland Park A&P.
Also, anybody know if Foodtown owners are allowed to open stores in towns where another already does business? I was thinking Nicholas or another owner could've snagged Wayne but Jack's Foodtown already does biz there.
There's no space available in the center. I too am amazed that Chase is operating out of a trailer! The store is empty, needs cleaning and re stocking, it's about 59,000 sq ft., at one time it was the second largest 'A&P' store in the company. Ugly outside IMO, nice fresh decor round one. First 'fresh' remodel of an A&P in NY. Mt.Kisco and Hopewell opened as Fresh Markets. Patterson was a Super A&P Food Market with Chase inside.
I would assume that Acme wants do intensive remodeling for stores that they acquired at the end and have closed and have to reopen. The Interiors May resemble the new Acme in Long Bech Township. Since they were down to skeleton crews at the end of their liquidations when Acme entered the picture they also have to be re-staffed with the Union probably having a lot of import in who else gets re hired.
If memory serves me right, Hopewell Junction was a replacement for a old Futurestore south of there on NY 52 and that filled a hole left when Grand Union just down the street went under and a CVS moved in.
If the Ahold/Delhaize merger goes through, I wonder if Acme will go for the Hannaford locations in Red Hook and Wappingers Falls that will inevitably be divested. Coincidence about the latter is it was once a Waldbaums.
Hopewell was not a replacement for the former Fishkill A&P Futurestore which was remodeled and converted to a Food Market before Hopewell was built from the ground up! Fishkill died a slow death due to the Walmart on Rt9 converting to a Supercenter. Fishkill, Hopewell and LaGrange, only one mile down the road from each other all operated at one time with the hopes that between the three they would do a million a week in business. This never happened, Fishkill closed and now Acme and ShopRite will have the two former A&P's one mile apart. Acme in Hopewell and ShopRite in LaGrangeville.
And of course Ocean State has the Futurestore, which should mean it will retain it's style for some time to come (as OSJL doesn't tend to do much renovation unless absolutely needed). And perhaps they will get some America's Choice stuff to sell there!
Are the other two really only a mile apart? Always seemed farther than that.
A number of people expressed interest in buying America's Choice products after A&P shut down. Were their products any different than other stores' house brands? Or are folks simply interested in getting deep discounts?
Probably some of both (some items that people may just like that particular brand, some just figure if it's a good deal for something they'd use anyway) plus a certain amount of the "nostalgia" factor of it not being available again in the future so get one now to keep the label/box/bottle for collection.
One topic I have not seen discussed on this blog yet is "food deserts." I don't necessarily agree myself that they exist. I always heard that Detroit is a food desert, but after I visited the city on four separate occasions, I found it to be a food Mecca instead actually. Detroit has the Eastern Market, which is this extensive farm market. They also have many independently owned grocery stores.
Here is an article on the subject. Do you think mainstream supermarkets should move into urban areas? I know Acme took over a Pathmark in Newark, and I liked it when I was there.
King Kullen (a Long Island chain) just took over the North Patchogue Waldbaums. They managed to make the store pop with a nice paint job and replacement of fixtures.
(This one was posted back in November, but the November topic was never posted in time and it got kinda lost):
ReplyDeleteOne thing I haven't seen in any reviews of Acme is the Frosted Mug Café. Some stores just look like they've just added a beer department (standard in many supermarkets) with some seating thrown in, but some have taps. Since I assume it's not self-serve, do they have someone serving beer? I've thought that stores that sell beer and wine by the glass are rather cool in and of themselves...
I should go to the one in Concordville. I live about 30 minutes from there, and I've seen the billboards advertising it. I have been to the nearby Whole Foods a few times and they have an actual bar with stools that is in a separate room from the rest of the store. And they serve beer/wine. Most of the beer is merchandised along the walls outside of the store, which lead to a lot of confusion, because people thought they could buy beer at any register. It's restricted to just the register inside of the bar. Which seems pretty stupid to me. Pennsylvania has been updating their alcohol laws, but still have a ways to go.
DeleteI also need to get into the new Wegmans up there. I haven't been up there since it was still under construction. It's been open 3 weeks now. I'm sure they have an expansive beer selection as well.
Wegmans there seems to be more food-centric (and a large beer/alcohol area) and has less in the way of general merchandise.
DeleteThat Wegmans was built a lot smaller than most of their stores. Maybe they realized the general merchandise (which is quite extensive in their larger stores) just isn't moving.
DeleteYou guys are right! That store is really tiny compared to a typical Wegmans. I shopped there for the first time today and was really surprised at how small every department was and how small the various grocery sections were. And the store is even in there sideways, which is odd. I came through the side door into the cafe/pub and was met with a lot of exiting traffic. Next time i'll know better and go through the front. I'm also curious as to what all opens up in the strip malls in front of the store.
DeleteThe doors of cold single beer/make your own 6 packs was a nice touch, though. They really were focusing on craft and higher end beers instead of throwing a bunch of Coors and Bud in our faces.
Rumors of more conversions Boonton I have pretty much confirmed and on their blog Acme is not denying it nor are they denying West Milford on the other hand they kind of debunk The Patterson New York rumor. Any other A&P, Pathmark, SuperFresh even Waldbaums Acme conversation rumors out there?
ReplyDeleteWest Milford would make sense since that's a similar situation as the one in places like Sussex, Vernon and Blairstown. I'm thinking quite a few locations make sense for considerably less than they would have sold for months ago but haven't heard anything being mentioned.
ReplyDeleteI think West Milford would be a big mistake as there is a shop rite right down the street and another shop rite in Warwick NY about 15 min or so away. It didn't do any business at all as A&P unless Acme goes in and does a full scale remodel and upgrade before they reopen, then maybe it will work.
DeleteOn the other hand, there are other places where Acme (and other stores) do just fine competing with ShopRite.
DeleteThe question (I guess) is how much of the not doing business was due to the location and how much of it was due to the operator (A&P)?
It's probably a little of both. I serviced that store for a little over 2 years as a vendor. Was my worst store on my route. That's why I'm saying maybe it's a mistake for Acme. Like I said maybe if they get the store really cheap and do a full fledged remodel then maybe it might work. Otherwise I think something like Dollar General might work good there, kinda like the one that went into the old Acme in Newton, NJ.
DeleteHaggen bit off way more than they could chew, and went bankrupt and is selling off all their stores. The judge even allowed Albertsons to buy back some locations since there were no other bidders.
ReplyDeleteThere's an Acme connection to the Haggen saga. At least two of the stores (2235 University Ave and 422 W. Washington St. in San Diego) were built as Acme-era peak-roofed Alpha Betas. However, Albertson's is not buying either one of these locations.
DeleteIt would be interesting if somebody bought the A&P chain. But that will probably never happen.
ReplyDeleteFrom what I can tell, there aren't many links left in the chain. It seems that the name is tarnished right now. However, in a few years maybe someone could open stores under the A&P name.
DeleteWhat's there to buy?
Deletechris p- The oldest supermarket chain in the U.S., the name, and their partnerships of companies. Remember Hostess? They went bankrupt but a few years later somebody else bought the company and resumed manufacturing.
DeletePhysiFiscal Fitness - I agree.
DeleteThey did not buy Hostess. They bought the names of the iconic products within ie: twinkies, Wonderbread. Similar to the way A&P sold off the 8 o'clock coffee brand a number of years back. A&P has not had a positive name recognition in many years. Its time to lay to rest the name and not let emotional attachments cloud vision.
DeleteActually, one company bought out Hostess and resumed manufacturing in their existing facilities, but without the unions. They also ship through store warehouses/distributors, not direct store delivery like they were before (which also eliminates another union).
DeleteFlowers Foods bought Wonder and the other bread brands. Incidentally, Flowers also owns Tastykake in Philadelphia. They bit off more they could chew when they built their new HQ, so they needed someone to bail them out.
Drake, which was part of Hostess, was sold separately to Little Debbie. Their distributors now deliver Drake brand cakes.
You can't buy a chain if the chain doesn't exist. If someone was going to step up and buy A&P they would've done so right after the company started selling off stores. The reason why they didn't was because A&P was damaged goods, damaged so severely that it would've taken an absolute miracle to turn it around.
DeleteYou can buy the name, the private label brand names, the Internet domain, etc without buying a single store.
DeleteSomeone bought out the Montgomery Wards name and now run it exclusively as an online store.
There is a certain amount of nostalgia, familiarity, goodwill, loyalty, etc associated with a brand name.
Patterson is going to open in January, this from Brewster and Mahopac employees! Chase bank moves into a trailer in the parking lot until Acme takes over.
ReplyDeleteA trailer? Well, that's a new one. You think they'd move into another building.
DeleteHere's the thing about bank branches: they have a license to operate a branch at a specific location. If they wish to move to a different location, they have to obtain permission from their regulator. For example, when a branch of a local bank burned to the ground, they needed permission if they wanted to locate to another building or if they wanted to close the branch. Not sure what they would have done if both were declined, given there was no more building. But I digress.
DeleteIt is easier to get permission from a regulator to temporarily operate out of a temporary structure, such as a trailer, in the parking lot of the existing branch location than it is to relocate the branch.
That's OK - I remember one area up this way where Rite Aid was rebuilding their store and they moved the pharmacy portion into a trailer down the street in the supermarket's parking lot. Apparently where they were there was not room to build a new store without closing and removing the old one.
DeleteOne of the Rite Aids in my hometown did the trailer thing too, but they were forced into doing so because the roof collapsed in the store and they had to rebuild the entire store from the ground up.
DeleteI've seen banks operate out of trailers. One was when a strip mall burned and they were forced out. The just dropped a trailer in the parking lot and kept on going.
DeleteThe other was when another bank was waiting for their branch to be built. They operated out of the trailer before they broke ground for the actual branch if memory serves me correctly.
Makes perfect sense for Chase to open in a trailer, as a storefront would require higher rents, new signage, etc.
DeleteMost of their décor, furnishings, and signage, I imagine, is still intact at the A&P, and doing this will ensure the fact that once ACME reopens, the bank will move back in without much trouble.
According to an Employee I spoke to in Oak Ridge Boonton will also open in January.
ReplyDeleteCan you do pictures of the ACME's in the Yorktown area?
ReplyDeleteI took pictures of Yorktown Heights and Shrub Oak when They were still A&Ps i'm going to see if I can get them again as Acme the next time I am in Westchester County
DeleteFoodtown is taking over the A&Ps in Old Tappan and Washington Township. Wasn't sure if that was mentioned before.
ReplyDeleteFunny thing is, Old Tappan was a Vitale Foodtown before A&P acquired almost all their locations.
DeleteI believe Washington Township was also once a Foodtown. Nicholas Markets Inc who now owns the WT Foodtown is going to do a major renovation right after the holidays as its going to be similar to the North Haledon location.
DeleteNot only was the Foodtown in Washington Township an A&P purchase, it was also a Vitale store.
DeleteWhen Foodtown imploded, it was the Vitale stores that were sold off, as it was one of the Vitale brothers that caused the implosion. I don't think Nicholas got rid of stores until later on, after their failed attempt at being Adams food stores (a name used by other stores that were also supplied by Bozzuto's).
DeleteSo all of the Nicholas stores had that Adams Super Food Store name? Weird.
DeleteHonestly, I was surprised that Nicholas got rid of their Paterson and Haledon stores. Especially the Haledon store because that was right on the main drag. I'm also surprised, considering Nicholas is based there, that they didn't make a run at the Woodland Park A&P.
Also, anybody know if Foodtown owners are allowed to open stores in towns where another already does business? I was thinking Nicholas or another owner could've snagged Wayne but Jack's Foodtown already does biz there.
When I worked for Foodtown, I remember hearing there was a 5 mile requirement.
DeleteThere's no space available in the center. I too am amazed that Chase is operating out of a trailer! The store is empty, needs cleaning and re stocking, it's about 59,000 sq ft., at one time it was the second largest 'A&P' store in the company. Ugly outside IMO, nice fresh decor round one. First 'fresh' remodel of an A&P in NY. Mt.Kisco and Hopewell opened as Fresh Markets. Patterson was a Super A&P Food Market with Chase inside.
ReplyDeleteI would assume that Acme wants do intensive remodeling for stores that they acquired at the end and have closed and have to reopen. The Interiors May resemble the new Acme in Long Bech Township. Since they were down to skeleton crews at the end of their liquidations when Acme entered the picture they also have to be re-staffed with the Union probably having a lot of import in who else gets re hired.
DeleteIf memory serves me right, Hopewell Junction was a replacement for a old Futurestore south of there on NY 52 and that filled a hole left when Grand Union just down the street went under and a CVS moved in.
DeleteIf the Ahold/Delhaize merger goes through, I wonder if Acme will go for the Hannaford locations in Red Hook and Wappingers Falls that will inevitably be divested. Coincidence about the latter is it was once a Waldbaums.
Hopewell was not a replacement for the former Fishkill A&P Futurestore which was remodeled and converted to a Food Market before Hopewell was built from the ground up! Fishkill died a slow death due to the Walmart on Rt9 converting to a Supercenter. Fishkill, Hopewell and LaGrange, only one mile down the road from each other all operated at one time with the hopes that between the three they would do a million a week in business. This never happened, Fishkill closed and now Acme and ShopRite will have the two former A&P's one mile apart. Acme in Hopewell and ShopRite in LaGrangeville.
ReplyDeleteAnd of course Ocean State has the Futurestore, which should mean it will retain it's style for some time to come (as OSJL doesn't tend to do much renovation unless absolutely needed).
DeleteAnd perhaps they will get some America's Choice stuff to sell there!
Are the other two really only a mile apart? Always seemed farther than that.
America's Choice products are available at Ollie's! I just got 3 boxes of black tea at the Ollie's in Pottstown, Pennsylvania.
ReplyDeleteA number of people expressed interest in buying America's Choice products after A&P shut down. Were their products any different than other stores' house brands? Or are folks simply interested in getting deep discounts?
DeleteProbably some of both (some items that people may just like that particular brand, some just figure if it's a good deal for something they'd use anyway) plus a certain amount of the "nostalgia" factor of it not being available again in the future so get one now to keep the label/box/bottle for collection.
DeleteAmerica's Choice was a pretty good private label brand. However, I'm only getting items for memories more than anything else.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.pressofatlanticcity.com/news/supermarkets-still-struggle-to-open-in-nj-food-deserts/article_71e7a42a-9cef-11e5-b1d5-037e179a83cf.html
ReplyDeleteOne topic I have not seen discussed on this blog yet is "food deserts." I don't necessarily agree myself that they exist. I always heard that Detroit is a food desert, but after I visited the city on four separate occasions, I found it to be a food Mecca instead actually. Detroit has the Eastern Market, which is this extensive farm market. They also have many independently owned grocery stores.
Here is an article on the subject. Do you think mainstream supermarkets should move into urban areas? I know Acme took over a Pathmark in Newark, and I liked it when I was there.
Does anyone know where I can get my hands on some America's Choice products in Pennsylvania?
ReplyDeleteKing Kullen (a Long Island chain) just took over the North Patchogue Waldbaums. They managed to make the store pop with a nice paint job and replacement of fixtures.
ReplyDeletehttps://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.1090217717678754.1073741831.1082753601758499&type=3